Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hello, I'm Jeremy Rivera, your unscripted small business podcast host. I'm here with Richard Hickman, who's going to introduce the expertise that he's been building for a generation that has culminated in his current venture called Peaked Consulting.
[00:00:21] Speaker B: Awesome. Thank you very much for having me.
[00:00:24] Speaker A: No problem. So what would you say you do here, Richard?
[00:00:30] Speaker B: Yeah, so I run and I'm the founder and help run a marketing agency specifically geared towards high ticket coaches.
[00:00:42] Speaker A: Is it consulting for the consultee? For the people that are doing the consulting? Like who is your ideal customer profile?
[00:00:53] Speaker B: Yeah, so my ideal customer is a high ticket coach, someone who is in the coaching industry.
Coaches, clients, maybe consults clients. You know, that term can be used interchangeably I think.
And you know, they're usually a solopreneur, maybe have one or two employees at this point. They've maybe making 20 grand a month or so, but they can't seem to break through and get a predictable sales system.
They're, you know, mostly relying on referrals and so forth. So we help them break through that referral ceiling and generate more predictable cash flow.
[00:01:34] Speaker A: As a solopreneur, frequent consultant and currently trying to grow my own agency model after switching up from being just a consultant.
What is the most fertile ground that you find when you start your engagements?
[00:01:53] Speaker B: Meaning like who's most ready?
[00:01:57] Speaker A: Not necessarily who's most ready, but like what aspect of that business is like going to give first routes where if you put the effort into it, like where's the area where you're going to want to do the work first? I mean there's, you can always take the aspect of that everything needs to be worked on, but you do need to focus in, you know, usually to invest in something that can have some sort of short to medium impact while you work on the bigger structure items. That might take some time.
[00:02:31] Speaker B: Yeah. So the very, very first thing we do with everybody is setting a foundation is what we call our first pillar. Right. And it's usually by bringing in a CRM and a marketing automation platform.
We really prefer go high level.
A lot of these coaches we find might be using some sort of a CRM, but they're not using it to its fullest capability. So we usually come in and help them install a CRM to be able to centralize their communications.
A lot of times they're still doing things on their personal cell phone.
We'll get them a high level phone number so that they can do text blasts and be more efficient that way and automate things.
And that way we can help them with kind of some reactivation campaigns right out the gate as well as just making sure that we help them with their show up rate for any booked calls that they have that they're already working on, stuff like that. So kind of shoring up that foundation with just some basic CRM practices is the very first thing we do for everybody.
[00:03:34] Speaker A: Any other items within that CRM checklist that you're trying to check off?
I know CRMs have a really wide range of what exactly that means.
I recall when I started in digital marketing we had an ingrown CRM for our website hosting company and we called it Skynet because it really was an abomination sent from the future to destroy us all.
CRM has become kind of a catch all phrase for a category of software that does an insane range of stuff.
[00:04:15] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:04:16] Speaker A: What falls outside of your, you know, general suggested range of okay, you need, need it to do, you don't need it to do these things, but like a core fundamental set of stuff in that CRM stack that you think that coaches, consultants really need to grab onto.
[00:04:37] Speaker B: Yeah, I think that the first thing is making sure that all of your communication is in one place so that as you grow and scale your team it's not like you've bring on a setter and now that setter has no idea what any of the communication has been because you've been talking to clients on your personal cell phone. That's very first is let's get a company phone number that is centralized that everybody can see.
Next is making sure that we get the calendar integrated so that we can start automating bookings and then show up sequences that help people who have booked a call actually show up and then just lead automation so that like when a new lead comes in, speed to lead is a thing. Right. We don't want to turn on ads if you don't have a follow up system in place. We don't want to turn on ads if you know it's going to take you two days to get to those leads. So we want to make sure that we put in some systems in place to be able to get some speed delete actually happening.
And with that is a pipeline so a way to track those leads rather than just a spreadsheet or trying to keep track of things in your brain. Like we need, we need to build some processes around this.
[00:05:47] Speaker A: How much of that ties into practices with Claude or GPT or other tools at this point for you?
[00:05:57] Speaker B: So most of it we've actually got it Pretty well dialed in except for the copy. Right.
So some, because every coach is different, has a different offer, different ICP of themselves for, for themselves. So we do utilize a lot of, of like AI to be able to help us generate some of this content and copy. Um, but then we're using the, the coach always has to review that material before we go live. Cause we don't want it to say something that is untrue. And we just met these coaches usually. So yeah, we have a lot of information during, on our, our onboarding, but they know themselves and their product better than anybody else, so they have to review it.
[00:06:43] Speaker A: Is there something about the nichification process, you know, choosing who you're targeting and who they're targeting? Who their, their ICP is that you fine tune or help them adjust that or is that come in like, hey, we're we're doing these guys and that's pretty locked in set.
[00:07:09] Speaker B: Yeah. Most of the time the clients that we're working with, they've got their ICP dialed in. Right. We're dealing usually with, with pretty well established coaches. They've sold their offer, they know who their audience is. I don't work with a lot of new, new coaches that are still trying to figure that out because to be honest, my like, yeah, step one is foundation, but step two that we get to as quickly as possible is start running paid ads because that's how you scale past referrals. And a lot of new coaches don't have their offer dialed in. They're not ready for ads yet. So I'm not usually working with them.
[00:07:47] Speaker A: Social media as a distribution channel.
What's your rubric for helping them choose or change which channels they're focusing on? On posting content, on interaction and engagement.
Uh, what, what are some of the telltale signs that hey, you're kind of wasting time on this social channel versus hey, this is driving meaningful conversations that are leading, that are leading to leads.
[00:08:25] Speaker B: Yeah. So I think that's the key indicator right there. Is, is your effort actually turning into leads?
If I think that organic social is a very important game, but you need to be doing things that are revenue generating first and foremost. And if your social media is not in a place where it's generating revenue yet, let's focus on generating revenue and then we can focus on that.
You know, Alex Hormozi, I love his stuff and his content. He says the rule of a hundred, you're not making a hundred thousand dollars a month yet. You need to be doing a hundred cold outreaches. A day and a hundred minutes of content creation and there's a third one, a hundred dollars a day in ad spend. And so it should be one of the things you're doing. If you don't have revenue coming in and you're just doing organic traffic, it's going to take a long time unless you get lucky and something pops. And even then you're going to have one, one post pop, you might get a few leads from it and then it's gonna dry up again. Probably you need something consistent and that's where ad spend comes in.
And content creation is a long term game.
[00:09:40] Speaker A: Right.
[00:09:40] Speaker B: Alex Hormozi said he'd been doing this for a lot of years before he started actually getting noticed online. And so yeah, that's, that's kind of my long winded answer to that.
[00:09:51] Speaker A: I like it. I'm curious, what are some of the failures you're finding in the pricing models that the coaches that you're that are coming in, what are some of the weaknesses, what are some of the problems of structuring either how they're getting paid, how they're charging, how they're following up retention rates, et cetera.
[00:10:15] Speaker B: So a lot of newer coaches that I end up on the phone with sometimes and we tell them, hey, you're not ready for ads yet. And the reason being a lot of times is they haven't developed the self confidence yet to value themselves and charge enough money so they're undercharging what they should be.
And because of that, the math does not work.
When you're an online coach, the cost to acquire a new customer is likely going to cost you several hundred dollars.
And if you're only charging a couple hundred dollars for your offer, it's not going to be scalable because you're going to have to front money to pay the acquisition cost, when in reality you want to be collecting enough cash in the beginning, at the very front to be able to cover your cost of acquisition and cover the cost of acquisition of another customer as well.
And so if you're not charging enough to do that and have some profit and pay for all your overhead, like you gotta, you gotta be charging more.
So that's why we usually don't work with someone unless their offer is at least four to $5,000 minimum, because you need the money for your cost of acquisition.
[00:11:30] Speaker A: With that trade off, it seems to me that out of four, $5,000 price point, you're more looking very often at a B2B space because in a coaching space, four to $5,000 out of a personal bank account seems rather on the high end.
Whereas as a business expense or part of a commitment by the CEO or, or something along those lines.
So how does that change the mathematics as, as a coach of, you know, then you get financing challenges like I have. I had the unfortunate scenario of somebody, they offered me net 30 terms but I, they requested that invoice after the first month of work had been completed. So really it was net 60 day terms for them which I had to take because of at the time my financial situation. Like okay, I really don't like this. Like you're giving you two months worth of work before I see a penny. But how do you play that game of if it is higher dollar then it could drip in slower.
[00:12:49] Speaker B: Yeah. And that's where you've just got to make sure that you're.
I like to tell people charge enough to where you're not having to make those types of concessions. Right.
So the idea is like a lot of these coaches, beginners, they're trying to quit their job. So it's like hey, you need to be charging $5,000 for your offer so that you can eventually quit your job and you don't have to make concessions like that.
That's, that's the goal is to charge enough and kind of stick to your guns and be like I'm sorry, that's not the way this works.
[00:13:27] Speaker A: So pretty much more set down, hey payment upfront portal versus allowing them to use any sort of like invoicing process.
[00:13:37] Speaker B: Yeah, it's either upfront or maybe half now, half in 30 days. But coaching is a like most of the time you're paying for it before you get it because otherwise you start getting into the pay on results land.
And that is a place that I highly recommend every coach stay as far away from as possible.
[00:14:00] Speaker A: That's good advice.
I would say that it only really works when you become part of the business model. Like if you get a piece of it or you have a profit share that can't be revoked on a rolling month to month basis because hey, your advice was great for first 12 months.
I don't need you anymore.
Yeah, there goes, there goes everything you did worked and you're giving them more good stuff and then their hockey stick starts to go up like, yep, see ya.
Yeah.
Which on the one hand, which I guess in one way is a difficulty that's always going to exist with successful consulting. Right. Like once they take off, they don't need you anymore, baby.
[00:14:53] Speaker B: Well, sometimes the goal would be to position yourself in a manner that they still need you. Right. I have some, some clients, they've been, you know, a leadership coach for 20 years. I was blown away when he, when he told me that he's like, yeah, I've had clients that I have been coaching. And yeah, in the beginning we were talking like, you know, once a week, and now it's like maybe once a month or once a quarter. But like now instead of being a coach, it's moved more into an advisor role.
Right. And so you position yourself to where you're still valuable and still an advisor, rather than, I'm just here to perform a service and when I'm done, I'm done.
[00:15:35] Speaker A: Got it. So it's a mindset and relationship shift.
[00:15:39] Speaker B: Relationship shift for sure. Yeah. If you stay in that, I'm just gonna coach. You get to, you know, $10,000 a month or something like that, right? Then they get to 10,000, they're like, okay, I'm done. It's like, well, no, that was step one. Now we gotta get you to 50 and I can still help you. Right? That was just step one and so forth. So positioning yourself to where you develop that really good relationship with that client rather than just perform a set service.
[00:16:06] Speaker A: I'm curious, what's your villain origin story here? How did you land on the business model of coaching the coaches?
[00:16:15] Speaker B: So, yeah, so I originally actually went to school for and was in the world of cybersecurity.
I went to school for digital forensics.
I worked on a lot of civil cases and then moved into like doing hacking stuff, like figuring out how did hackers get in and stuff like that. I worked on a lot of Russian hacker cases and other high profile hacking cases as a cybersecurity consultant. But then, and that worked really well when I was a single dude. But then I found my, my beautiful, wonderful wife and I became dad to her five wonderful kids overnight.
And being an on call cyber consultant 24, 7 does not work for dad life.
And so I decided to kind of take an exit from that life. Even. Even though I was making amazing money, I kind of liked, I not kind of. I really liked what I was doing, but my passion was more with being with my family. And so I decided to step out of that. And my wife had been a coach and is a coach. She's a public speaking coach. So I was like, okay, well, I built and sold a cybersecurity firm. I can help you build your coaching firm. Like, why not? I did all the backend stuff for that company. That cyber company that we built and sold.
Um, let's do this.
And so I started helping her build her business and a couple of her clients who are also coaches because she teaches public speaking. So a lot of coaches are into public speaking. Were like, hey, I need help too. Like, you've done awesome work for your wife. Can you come help me? And it kind of was born by accident, but that's. That's kind of where we're at. It really stemmed from me getting married and then helping my wife, who is a coach, and then helping her clients who are also coaches.
[00:18:06] Speaker A: Not bad as far as bill and origin stories go.
[00:18:10] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
[00:18:13] Speaker A: So what's. As far as, like, coaching niches, has the been the most difficult?
You know, like, giving advice to somebody in their niche is particularly difficult. I come from, you know, SEO and I've got some friends and in this space, you know, Michael McDougall and Timothy Jackson with Mercy Sake. And there's, there's definitely a challenge right now, especially as the ecosystem changes of, you know, the role of LLMs, and, you know, we had a couple of different difficult business seasons, you know, willingness to invest in it. And so from, like, the consulting side and, uh, it gets pretty thin. Um, but what's been your most difficult niche? Sub niche, I guess, of what category of markets has had the most trouble to grow?
[00:19:13] Speaker B: I would say a lot of the mindset type coaching has a really hard time right now because a lot of people are just going to chat GPT and using chatgpt as their therapist and so forth. Right. They're listening to more podcasts to be able to help them with their mindset and so forth. Now, I do think that there is a place for mindset coaches. Definitely. I've had them before and still do, and I think that they're very important. But it's really difficult to approach a cold prospect and convince them that you're going to help them with their mindset to be able to start achieving more. And it's just a lot of like, like, I'm gonna help you be more successful. I'm gonna help you like, and, and it's. And it's true. Mindset helps you with that, but it's hard for people to spend money on it when there's not a trackable roi.
And it's hard to track the ROI on mindset. If you have a good mindset, you know, you kind of just know that, like, yeah, I know that if I didn't talk to that mindset coach and fix my mindset, my Business would not be the way it is today. And so I can track backwards and say, I know that I've made a million dollars because I hired that mindset coach, but to look at that facing forward is really difficult. So that's what I would say is the mindset stuff is really difficult right now to overcome that barrier. Business coaches, it's great. You show an ROI and they're like, hey, mathematically this makes sense. We overcome objections, we move forward because we know that we're going to make money from it, or at least we think so. Right. That's why we're hiring that business coach. It's the mindset that's tough right now.
[00:20:57] Speaker A: What's the most esoteric niche that you've consulted the consultant in?
[00:21:05] Speaker B: Esoteric meaning like someone who is just like way obscure and out there. Yeah. So I once worked with a coach that is, she's an astrology advisor, I guess you could say.
Which I definitely believe in some of that kind of stuff, but I'm not a huge reliar on that kind of stuff and I think that there are a lot fewer people that do that.
And so it's tough. That one's tough for sure. You gotta find very specific people that are into the same thing you are when you're an astrology type advisor and coach.
[00:21:47] Speaker A: You touched on one aspect of the way that LLMs are changing the arena for your clients, which is literally just asking ChatGPT hiring, paying $20 a month for your Claude to play a therapist role.
Yeah.
What are some of the ways that you are using it as a potential channel or understanding or helping them harness or utilize it as a new discovery channel as a, a way for them to get found.
Yeah.
[00:22:27] Speaker B: So you mentioned SEO. Right. And I think nowadays it's, there's another step to that.
There's a lot of different terms for it. I refer to it as AEO or Answer Engine optimization. I've also heard Generative Engine Optimization. Right.
[00:22:44] Speaker A: Or geo Everywhere optimization is.
[00:22:48] Speaker B: Right.
[00:22:48] Speaker A: Came up in my last one.
[00:22:51] Speaker B: So I think building our websites in a manner that, that, that matches that AEO strategy. Just like we can't just throw up a website and it's going to magically rank on Google like even, even a couple of years ago. Right. We, we needed to build that in a certain manner so, so that it would rank and I. And now we're seeing ourselves in a world where we not only need to build it so that we rank organically on Google, but we also want to be coming up in the answers so that when your prospective client goes to ChatGPT and says, how do I grow my business?
It says, oh, Jeremy has this X, Y, Z formula that he uses to help businesses do exactly what you're asking and refers to you and its answer.
That's the goal is to build your website in a way that ChatGPT refers to you and its answers. Because let's be honest, most people trust their chat almost too much. Right. And if you, if you can get chat to recommend you, you're, you're more than likely going to get a sale.
[00:23:56] Speaker A: Yeah. Just like my friend Matt Brooks says that it's a terrible customer support representative who doesn't know anything about you. But, but it's out there already doing that job. You didn't pay them to do it. But if you don't give that customer support rep any training, it's going to go off. Sure, you can make a homepage that's really just like five pictures of yourself, your dog, your cat, say, I'm a great coach.
Okay, well you gave the, you gave the LLMs this much information.
It's going to either not reference you or make, make up whatever it wants to. So, yep, yeah, yeah, kind of Mad
[00:24:38] Speaker B: Libs, I usually tell people like you've, you've, yeah, you gotta do all the traditional SEO stuff, but then also start building your website to where you need to be building your website to where it's not necessarily geared towards a human being visiting it, but an AI visiting it and writing blog posts. Which is funny, right? Because it's like, who reads blogs anymore? AIs do, right? Perplexity reads your blog chat GPT reads your blog. So write a blog post that's titled the question that your prospects are asking ChatGPT so that then when ChatGPT goes out and searches the Internet for that thing, it's like, oh, here's an entire article that was written about this exact question, right? And it's like, yeah, that's probably not going to come up in someone's Google search, but it'll probably come up in their chat search.
[00:25:34] Speaker A: I think it's funny because there's, there's, there's two sides of this argument of like and it.
I have to admit that part of it is the bias of the success that content marketers had from 2010 to 2020 where we could just throw out thousands of top level articles as like mass fishing in the ocean. And now that that doesn't work, they're like top of funnels dead. Only focus on the bottom of Funnel. But you're right, there's a counter argument of if we are seeing LLMs digest and cite information it and we don't with too much of a black box to even be able to tell when or why or how or how frequently, even with the same query. So it's a little bit of a Hail Mary. But you're right that we do need to better inform every LLM model about what it is our offer is how we can structure our expertise.
And it's really a reflection of the human side of things. Like if I'm having a conversation and they bring up a challenge, I'm like, oh yeah, I wrote a post about that last month.
That's instant credibility.
You know, it's the same thing exactly with LLM tools. Oh, you wrote some wrote about that. That's a reference. Maybe as a link, maybe not. Like it's just not tied to the hardcore metrics that we generally have used in the SEO practices. But you're right, there's still a lot of value and social media value back your social posts with an article.
[00:27:13] Speaker B: Yeah, instead of just writing, you know, posting whatever chatgpt told you to post, like let's, let's, let's actually reference some material and push them to your website and then have clear call to action on your website so that you can turn those into actual leads rather than just sending them to the homepage of your website and hoping that they, you know, book a call or something like that.
[00:27:40] Speaker A: Downloadable with a just click to download versus a email gate on a downloadable asset.
Which path do you prefer?
[00:27:55] Speaker B: I definitely prefer at least getting their email address, if not their email address and their phone number in order to get something like I think that's a fair exchange. Like sure, free content out there, social media. Post it. Like post your long form YouTube videos that give away a lot of the same information.
But then the, the way you organize it into a guide or something like that, you know, those types of things, you should, you should be behind some sort of a form for sure. I'm a huge proponent of that. Otherwise you're giving away information for free and you're never going to make any sales cause you're not going to collect leads.
[00:28:36] Speaker A: Definitely. Okay, I've had like several different conversations recently about that.
But it mostly ties back to a lack of like a follow up process. You know, like, oh, I've got an email goodie versus somebody who's got an email. They're like cha Ching.
[00:28:57] Speaker B: Yeah. And that's why our step number one is set that foundation because most people like you just said they're like, oh, whoop dee doo, I have an email. It's like, you know that email is valuable.
I don't care if you have like, I know someone, I know someone in particular that they have like combined across all their social media channels, several million followers.
But their email and customer list is this. They've never collected an email, They've never collected a phone number. They have nothing.
And when this person and, and it was interesting because we had a TikTok outage mandated by the government a little while ago, if you guys remember that. Right.
[00:29:42] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:29:43] Speaker B: And this individual was freaking out because their entire livelihood got shut down.
And it's like if you had been collecting emails, it wouldn't matter if TikTok went down.
That's my opinion. Social media is great, but don't rely on it because it could go away in an instant. And we've seen it happen.
[00:30:03] Speaker A: Yeah. And you know, we should know better in the digital marketing industry as well because we've seen, you know, Facebook go from, hey, it's an organic playground. Every business is got a Facebook page and they're posting content consistently to now it is 100,000% pay to play. You cannot get an ounce out of meta without paying your. Your pound in tribute.
[00:30:30] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:30:32] Speaker A: So, you know, we're, we're learning that hard lesson in SEO and you know, with, you know, these newcomers, ChatGPT, Claude, Google clawing back with the helpful content update.
A lot of content creators were just like, hey, this you will pay me to create cooking content. I'll keep creating cooking content.
Well, at some point Google realized, well, there's only, you know, we only need 340 people with a quiche recipe and we don't need another new person with a quiche recipe.
Really. Not additive.
Uh, we've kind of hit, hit the max and they reset things with helpful content update. And a lot of people lost their livelihoods with that shuffle around of the algorithm. So we should have have known better in the SEO space because we live or die. You know, we've lived and died by these algorithm changes or, you know, Penguin Panda, like huge changes on the like weekly update algorithm updates. It, it's changed that we've gotten used to, but we didn't see that we'd become reliant on always just, you know, treating SEO as a fresh ocean into which we could go and fish and have no audience retention.
[00:31:59] Speaker B: Yeah, it's huge. Audience retention is huge.
[00:32:03] Speaker A: What are some of the mechanisms that you advise for coaches to build into their workflows, to sustain that audience, to have an eye on retention, on churn.
[00:32:18] Speaker B: Yeah, I think the most underutilized channel is email marketing.
A lot of coaches I talk to are like, I don't want to be that guy that's spamming. And it's like, listen, we all get a ton of emails, to be honest. You need to make yours just better than the others. And I know that sounds, you know, easier said than done, but that's what really needs to happen. You need to nurture these. Because if you only email blast when you've got a new offer or you've got some event, and every time you email, it's an ask, no one's gonna open your emails and you're not gonna nurture that audience. You need to be sending out value add emails once a week, minimum.
I love him or hate him, Grant Cardone talks about how he will email people five times a day and he has a huge email list. And sure, we might be annoyed by it, but, like, I've not unsubscribed from Grant Cardone. I learn a ton from Grant Cardone from time to time, right. And so I don't care that he emails me three times a day or five times or whatever, you know, and that's the way we should be treating email marketing is we need to be actually emailing people. We need to be in front of their faces.
[00:33:29] Speaker A: So it's like just more of that subconscious reality of, you know, more thinking of it as advertising touches that we're, you know, laying down the found work, found foundation, so that later when we do bring up the ask, it's not the fifth time they've been asked, it's the first. But they can think back. Oh, I read that article that time. Oh, he did that interview. Oh, he gave this insight. Oh, I saw that clip. Oh, I saw that. TikTok.
[00:33:59] Speaker B: Yep. And. And then it goes back to that whole idea that, that Gary Vee talked about. I, I like, he's, I think jab, jab, jab, hook, right?
[00:34:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:34:07] Speaker B: And so it's give, give, give, give, and then ask with your hook. And that's what's going to really make that hook land.
Because if you're just hooking every single time, you're. It's gonna, it's not gonna land.
So, yeah, jab, jab, jab, hook doesn't just apply to social media, it applies to email as well.
[00:34:27] Speaker A: Curious what your take is on the inherent paradox that is authenticity and marketing.
Because to effectively market you have to do so, you know, credibly, but you also, you know, are rehearsing things and saying things multiple, repeated times and for a specific targeted purpose. So there's inauthenticity there because you're, you know, doing it with the intention to make money from them. First of all, that's always, always true in a business context.
But also, you know, you're, you know, kind of using them in a way. So how do you check the box of authenticity as a requirement of that human to human interaction, but also accept the reality of, well, it's still a business and I'm trying to get money, I'm trying to get paid for what I do by you.
[00:35:39] Speaker B: Yeah. So I think that it's, first of all, if, if we are approaching it in a, you know, I, I'm not being authentic about this and I just want to do this for money and I'm just using you to make money.
I, in my opinion, that's a bad person.
Steer clear of those people.
Right. I like to work with clients that are, yes, they, they have a livelihood. Right.
And, but their goal is to help people. That's why we become coaches. That's why most coaches become coaches because they have a goal. They're like, I did something awesome and I want to help people do the same thing.
Yes, it is valuable and I need to make a living and I'm going to make money and I might even get stupid rich from doing this.
But in all reality, I'm here to help people. Those are the good people that I'm looking for. Sorry. Those are the good people that I'm looking for to, to work with. If I come across someone that is like, no, I'm just in it for the money and I don't really care. Like, just give me a script and I'll do whatever you think is going to make me the most money. I'm probably not going to work with that person. I don't want to work with those people.
[00:36:46] Speaker A: So then it really comes down to, you know, because I run into that a lot more in sales, you know. Cause that's just the marketplace there tends to lead to more, more fake friendliness. But, you know, I guess it's a good byline of like, hey, you know what? Some people just are like that. So maybe they're just not the ones that I work with. So it's being selective.
[00:37:13] Speaker B: It is, it's being. And it comes back to like, like we were saying before on the, on that example you gave of the net 60, like, we've just got to be in a position where we can say no to people because we just don't deal with that.
[00:37:25] Speaker A: Yeah, because desperation exactly puts off an odor, you know, in that conversation. Like you really need, you know, if you're really hurting, then it can come across in the way that you're positioning your offer.
[00:37:39] Speaker B: Yeah. And. And the, the people that are inauthentic and just in it for the money, people can smell that. They can smell it. They know.
They know.
[00:37:50] Speaker A: Um, I'm curious, have you done a lot of podcast interviews recently?
[00:37:55] Speaker B: I've started to, yeah. Ironically enough, that's like my, my wife's main thing right now is helping public speakers get on podcasts. And so that's why I'm. I've now kind of started doing more podcast interviews and then I recently started my own podcast.
[00:38:10] Speaker A: So.
[00:38:11] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:38:11] Speaker A: Awesome. Give it, Give it a shout out. What, what's your, what's your podcast?
[00:38:15] Speaker B: It's the business of high ticket coaching.
The podcast aims to, like I was saying before, there's a lot of, like, mindset stuff out there, right. And every business owner needs to hear that, needs to hear the David Goggins tell them, shut up, put your shoes on and get to work. You know, they need that. But there's enough of that content out there. The aim for my podcast is to be more tactical and operational and bringing on coaches that have kind of figured some things out and say, okay, who was your first hire and why?
What marketing tactics actually worked? What didn't work? What did you. What was the biggest waste of money in your, in your business? Like, that's the type of stuff because, like, hearing the. You just gotta grind sometimes is. Yeah, that's true. But what do I actually go do?
[00:39:06] Speaker A: Yeah, that's what I'm grind. What? Where?
[00:39:10] Speaker B: What do I do? Yeah, grind.
[00:39:11] Speaker A: What, where?
[00:39:12] Speaker B: For how long?
[00:39:13] Speaker A: In what direction, with what gauge? Grindstone, you know, is it a lateral? Is it cross lateral? Give me specifics.
[00:39:22] Speaker B: Exactly. That's the aim of my podcast, is to give the specifics so that when you hear the David Goggins type material that says get out there and grind, you can come to my podcast and find out what exactly that actually means and what you need to do.
So it's going to be launching soon? We haven't actually launched yet. I've got a couple of interviews in the, in the hopper. I want to make sure that I've got a bunch so that I don't, like, start producing episodes and then run out of episodes because I get behind or Something. So I want to have a bunch in the bag before, before I start releasing episodes, but they should be starting off pretty soon here, so.
[00:39:56] Speaker A: Well, I'll put a placeholder link in the show notes and update it so people in the future listening to the sound of my voice from the depths of history are like, oh, is that live? Instead of like, yeah, launch at some point, I'll add it to the show notes and then update when you, when you actually do launch.
I'm curious.
[00:40:17] Speaker B: Thank you.
[00:40:18] Speaker A: What is a question that you haven't been asked in your other podcast interviews that you wish you had?
[00:40:26] Speaker B: Ooh, that's a good question. You know, I don't know that I have one that I maybe haven't been asked, but I, I, I remember someone asked me once a, a question that I really, really liked that I hadn't been asked before.
And, and it's, it's, and it was interesting too, cause it feels like a no brainer to me. But like, I, I brought up, I, I, I, you know, became a stepdad to five kids. We've had one more since then. So I have six kids and, and they asked me like, how do you balance being an entrepreneur and a dad to six?
[00:41:01] Speaker A: Right.
[00:41:01] Speaker B: Cause a lot of times my podcast interviews are all about business and so forth. And that's great, that's what I'm here to talk about. But my passion is my family. And so for me it's sacrifice.
I'm an early riser.
I'm up between 4 and 5 most days so that I can actually get some focused work done before anybody else wakes up. So, so that I can spend time with my kids.
Cause the goal is to raise kids that want to come back home after they're adults.
And that's my goal. And I have two adult kids at this point now. And one of them still lives at home because she doesn't hate us and the other one comes home regularly.
Granted, we bribe her with free food, but she comes home, she doesn't hate us. And that's the goal, is to make it so that our, our, our kids don't hate us and, and want to actually spend time with us when they don't have to.
[00:41:56] Speaker A: I have a fantastic interview with George Rivera and he, he has like a small table for CEOs and founders to nurture. For men, a particular culture of don't abandon your family for your success.
And it really struck me cause there, there have been times where I have been on that hustle train.
Um, I've chosen now to live More of a entrepreneurial life as a freelance consultant. But, you know, there was a time where I was, you know, commuting, you know, one to two hours each way to get to a job.
And when my wife got pregnant, I'm like, I can't. I can't be, you know, have a variable factor of one to two hours of extra travel per day. And honestly, the pay wasn't that great. I just kind of settled into this corpo expectation life and, you know, the 9 to 5 kind of, you know, it can suck your soul out.
[00:42:57] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah, it can.
Good for you for giving it up.
[00:43:05] Speaker A: So kind of wrapping up. Give a shout out for your domain name if there's any special resources that you'd like to put point people to any upcoming events or interviews that you know that are being released. I'll make sure that anything cool gets linked in the show notes. Anything you give me that's crap won't get linked in the show notes. I'm kidding.
It'll all go into the show notes. I'll let people make their own decision whether it's good or not good.
[00:43:33] Speaker B: But yeah, yeah. So I actually put together a free AI audit for coaches that, where you can put in, like, what is your coaching niche? What's the number one question your potential clients might ask? And it will go and check chat, Gemini, Perplexity, Claude. And it'll check and see if you're referenced in the answers and then let you know. And then if you're not, give you some pointers on some of the things you can do on your website to start showing up in these AI searches. So you can head over to coachingai audit.com and. And do that free audit.
[00:44:08] Speaker A: Fantastic. Well, thanks so much for your time. Appreciate you coming out. If you're listening to this episode, I'll have the full show notes. I release an episode at unscript, an article@unscripted SEO.com full of almost the entire transcript. So if you're a reader as much as you are a listener, you want to get a segment of the text, go check it out.
I have unscripted SEO as well as unscripted small business.
All of the notes will be up there. Thank you so much again for stopping by.
[00:44:46] Speaker B: Thank you for having me.
