Episode Transcript
[00:00:01] Speaker A: Hello, welcome to another episode of Unscripted. I am Zanetta Chuni Power. And today I have another lovely and amazing guest, Rebecca Prejean. How are you today?
[00:00:13] Speaker B: I'm doing well. Thank you so much for having me.
[00:00:16] Speaker A: Thank you for being on. I see we are, you know, emanating the same energy we have on green shirts here, so I think that means something. I think we're going to have a great conversation.
[00:00:26] Speaker B: But yes, prosperity and power.
[00:00:28] Speaker A: Yes. Okay, so tell me a little bit more about what you do.
[00:00:32] Speaker B: So in that show, what I do is I make things accessible for people with adhd, autism, dyslexia, all of the things. I just do it in corporate America.
So if a company needs training, you know, elearnings, graphics, videos, animated videos, whatever the case may be, the they come to me, but I make sure that everybody can actually use it, process it, and then, you know, implement it into their work.
[00:00:59] Speaker A: Amazing. So how did you get started in this particular career path? It seems a bit niche. So was there a turning point for you in another area? I want to know the whole scoop on how you landed into this type of work.
[00:01:13] Speaker B: Definitely niche. And there's always a story when there's a niche. It's what I tell people. Exactly. And for me, I've actually been in learning and development kind of this space for over 10 years at this point. I didn't start my journey into the accessible piece until I became a mom.
So I have a nine year old son. He will be nine in a couple of weeks. His name is Ethan and he has autism.
And for us, that wasn't something we thought about on the roadmap. It was a complete surprise. But even before he was born, they had told us he would not walk, he wouldn't talk because he also has hydrocephalus, which is fluid in the brain. And so they told us this child would have seizures, he would, you know, just be a vegetable. And he is not. He is a walking, talking, running around, sassy nine year old boy. But he thinks different. And we struggled a lot to find resources for him, to find people who actually believed in him, to find people who would actually support him, who would hold, hold space for him and let him be his best self. And it was a real struggle as a family.
So while all that was going on, I'm training people in these classes at work, right, Training them how to do their jobs and things like that. And we are having conversations in management about why such and such can't do this or such and such can't get this why don't they understand it? And it's like I made that connection between the child I saw every day, the one that I'm advocating for, and the people that are. That are in my room every day. I'm like, that's the. That's the missing link. That's why they can't get it.
That's why they are struggling, because they think different. And we're not meeting them anywhere near where they're at. We're telling them, digest this stuff that should be done in, like, probably three, four weeks. Digest it in four days, get out here, do your job, and do it well, or we're going to look at you like you're crazy. Like that's what we were giving them.
And so I always believe the universe has a plan. And so after being laid off, just really inadvertently, just completely shocked and getting a decent severance, I said, you know, I have a choice. I can go back into corporate and continue to do this, or I can build a business and a life that serves the purpose I wanted to serve, which is creating the spaces for my son. He's nine today, but he will be 18 in another nine years. That is shocking to me, but he'll be 18. And I want him to have all of the options. I want him to have all of the choices. I want him to have all of the paths he can possibly take. And who's going to create those paths in those rooms better than I am?
Nobody.
So I decided to start my business, and it's been great. It's not always easy. I tell people that all the time. I'm still a mom.
I'm a single mom. So, you know, I take care of him, and it's wonderful, but it's. It's a hoof. But I love what I do well.
[00:04:24] Speaker A: That's awesome. I am very proud of you and very excited for baby boy to have many, many more birthdays. So, yes, let's just give a little respect on that, because that in itself is a bless. And so you making this pivot is very important. And as I have conversations, not only this show, but just in my everyday life, you know, women entering certain life transitions after a large pivot, whether it be a divorce or any sort of loss. And that loss can also include a job loss. And that changes your mind on how can I really use my time in a more meaningful way that gives value to my time, efforts and skills, but it's also something that I can monetize because we live in America and we need. We need money. Right. And so it is. It's you taking this journey. It mirrors so many other stories that I've heard before, but it's unique in its own because what you're doing is so important. So tell me more about your ideal clients and who you like to work with.
[00:05:31] Speaker B: I used to say I like to work with all the people, and in theory I do because everybody needs something accessible. So that's. There's truth in that for me. I like larger clients. I like larger corporate clients. I like law offices, Fortune 500s. I love to work with those folks. And some people ask me, well, why is that? Why wouldn't you work with a nonprofit that already has this kind of thought process in place?
Because I want to go with the people who don't have this thought process in place, because that is probably where people are hurting the most.
Honestly, that is where people are struggling the most.
[00:06:10] Speaker A: How is the conversation with organizations, especially right now, in this world of, you know, dare we say, anti dei? And a lot of conversations around DEI often focus on race relations or gender positions, whereas diversity also includes how you think.
And with budgets changing and attitudes changing around making those accommodations.
What do you say for where the industry stands right now in being more open to the types of services that you offer?
[00:06:46] Speaker B: Yeah, I think in general, where the industry stands, it's. Is it. It's in a weird place.
And, you know, there's so many things that we can all say about where we're at. Some people rail against it, some people are angry at it.
I'm just kind of like, this is what it is. And so we have to pivot into that. And so what that means, unfortunately, is not talking as much about people.
Because in the state that everything is in right now, let's all be honest, it's. The conversation is not about people. It's not about the human capital, it's about the monetary capital. And so that's where I have these discussions. Because when we talk about people who are neurodivergent, who have cognitive difficulties, who have sensory processing things, adhd, autism, all these things, right. They are still able to support a business and help you monetarily.
However, you have to give them the tools to be productive. So when we talk about these kinds of services, it should be in the lens of productivity, it should be in the lens of retention.
Because right now all businesses want to retain their people. They don't want to have to be to pay to retrain them. Right. It helps your top line, it helps your bottom line. It helps a bunch of different things.
So it's like we have to pivot. Like a lot of industries, we have to start pivoting away from the talk track we've had in the past and switch it to what we know matters. Right now, we are in an economic kind of flow.
So people are looking at money, they're looking at their budgets, they're looking at these things. And you have to bring value to that, and you can't. You just have to position things in a different way. And I just think that's. That's business. You ebb, you flow. You have to kind of be aware of what is happening.
Because how I get in the door, honestly, is how I get in the door. I don't care. As long as I get in the door, that's fine. Because if you want my services, as I've said to other people, the accessibility comes with it. It's built in, it's baked in.
So for me, the goal is to always get in the door and then I can work the rest out.
[00:08:51] Speaker A: Speaking of getting in the door, I have been hearing a lot about adult diagnosis of adhd. I actually have a friend who went down a rabbit hole, realized she has ADHD and it has changed her life in terms of how she approaches work.
And so what would you say for individuals who may be experiencing a later life diagnosis and want to be an advocate of your types, your services in their workplace or environment.
[00:09:25] Speaker B: If you have gotten a late diagnosis? Like I said, I myself am not neurodivergent. I truly am the advocate in the ally. Right.
If you have had that late diagnosis, though, take a breath.
Because some people, it can be overwhelming at first. Like, you unlock all these doors, right? Of all the things that have happened to you, and you're like, hopefully it makes so much more sense now. So it's like, you know, this bright light. But if you want to be an advocate, the first thing you want to do is make sure that you're advocating for yourself in your work, in your workspace, knowing what accommodations are open to you, knowing what the legalese is around that asking for those accommodations before you can advocate for somebody else. Excuse me, I'm about to sneeze.
Texas allergies.
We live in it.
You have to be able to advocate for yourself.
So the first thing I would say, if you want to kind of get into this space, don't just sit there with your diagnosis, and that's great, it's beautiful. But start to ask for the things that you need.
And what that does is it forces a lot of your companies that may not have any process, because I have met many that have no process at all for ADA accommodations. It forces them to create a process. It forces them to start to address those things. And that actually helps the people that come behind you.
It helps in a lot of different ways. They might not even have a diagnosis, the people coming behind you. But if we have these things in place for such and such, oh, maybe we can use them for this person over here. So that's why I say it doesn't have to be something grand. It doesn't have to be you. Starting a business you just advocating in your own space can actually create a lot of change without even, I don't want to say meaning to, but without realizing it.
[00:11:18] Speaker A: That's important. Sometimes it only takes one person to make a change. Kind of like when you're. This is so random but you're at a wedding reception and it's. They're like, who wants to go eat? And well, I'll go, yeah, everybody sits.
[00:11:32] Speaker B: Down and it's the awkward. But I don't want to be the first one to get up.
[00:11:36] Speaker A: I'll go hungry.
[00:11:38] Speaker B: And so it's like, well, if you.
[00:11:39] Speaker A: Go, I'll go, yeah, I will always go.
[00:11:44] Speaker B: Like I never have a problem. I will always go, where's I will.
[00:11:48] Speaker A: Go because I know you're hungry as well. And so again, you know, each one teach one to the best of their power and ability. It also makes me think of that. And so just feeling empowered to speak up at your workplace and ask for those things are really, really important. And as you said, not just for you, but for others who may matriculate through the you to matriculate through the organization behind you. And so what tools would you say are best to empower people whether they have this baked in training or not? How.
What, what are the steps to even getting your organization to take something on board? Or what tools can a person integrate that you all that you already offer to start the conversation around making this workspace or this environment a bit more palatable to their thinking pattern.
[00:12:41] Speaker B: Good questions, love them.
So even just asking like something that I do, people bring me in for a lot of different reasons. So it's a spectrum of things. But something that I'll do if they just ask for more procedural process type changes.
Getting an agenda for a meeting, creating an agenda for a meeting actually gives a lot of structure to the meeting, which then helps people who are neurodivergent because we're not going and scrolling and all that kind of stuff, right? It also helps them to prepare questions that might come up.
Actually having your presentation decks before meetings, those are simple things, right? If you happen to be in charge of multimedia things, not a big deal, have captions, have a transcript.
If you are somebody who does trainings, maybe e. Learning something I create, right? Having a companion guide with that elearning, having actual deadlines that are not crammed in or sandwiched in rather between different things. Giving some depth and some breadth to stuff like that. Those things just in a nutshell, it seems like stuff that doesn't even. It's not even that big, right? Like those are small things. Those are things you can implement.
Hey, there are plenty of people that listen to your podcast that are leaders, that do meetings, that facilitate meetings that facilitate weird workshops or seminars in their workplaces. Maybe you hadn't even planned to do that and they just throw it on you.
Have an agenda, have a schedule, have some real structure to it, have some planning, have groups beforehand, have people send you questions. Those kinds of things just being more inclusive, right? Being more proactive, more engaging. Those are things that help neurodivergent individuals more than. More than you know, because it allows them to get their questions. They're not thinking about things, they're not thinking about other things they can focus on, on whatever you're trying to give them in that moment.
[00:14:43] Speaker A: I'm nodding my head to the point where my neck hurts because those are the things that I require. Do not ambush me with a call. Please send an agenda.
Everything you just said are literal things that I require. And maybe I have neurodivergent, I'm not sure.
However, those steps as, as you said, give everyone an opportunity to zone in on what we're doing.
Because again, you may be someone who can hop on a call and then you're just spurring out ideas and I'm like, okay, pause.
Let's let that simmer for a second and then I will respond, you know, accordingly. And so I think on an individual level, wherever you stand across this spectrum is the ability to again, know how your brain works and to let you others have feedback and contribution on how this works, especially in a team environment for other leaders to understand that, you know, there is flexibility in how you get things done. But also sending agendas is one thing that can greatly increase the productivity of everyone. So shout out to making agendas because they're really important.
[00:15:57] Speaker B: I'm like super simple, super quick. Sending a summary at the end, just, it's just giving those little touch points for People to process.
I said, I am not neurodivergent, but I am not one that could ever just jump on a call period and be okay. Because my whole brain is like, why is this random call even happening?
Like, am I in trouble? It, you know, all the things, like, I was always anxious when that would happen.
And so I can't imagine what it's like for somebody else who's like, I don't know what this is. And now you're just throwing things at me. And I've had no chance to prepare. I don't know what questions to ask in this moment because I have a ton of them.
I have a ton of concerns. Like, it just, it's kind, it's respectful, it's organized and it's productive logic.
[00:16:49] Speaker A: I like it. I like that. And this is why, you know, as you said earlier, less about people, but more about productivity and those aspects. Because again, regardless of whether you're neurodivergent or not, anxious or otherwise, you know, these are things, as you said, they are kind and they encourage people to be a part of a team. Because that's what we want. We want to increase teamwork and collaboration.
So are there any moments in, you know, now that events are coming back and people are attending conferences and seminars and opportunities like that to really engage with people, people invested in this space. Are there any moments upcoming where you will be doing the same?
[00:17:37] Speaker B: Yes, I try to go to a few conferences a year in general. I try not to go to too many because I want to be around for my son and whatnot. But I have two coming up in the fall.
One will be at Cause Camp. It is for nonprofit organizations, nonprofit leaders.
Wonderful, wonderful folks. And that will be in Pittsburgh from November 1st to the 3rd.
I will be on the main stage and we will be talking about accessibility and the gap in accessibility, really in nonprofit organizations, especially when it comes to people of color and the BIPOC community.
So if you're in Pittsburgh, happen to be around there, it's going to be a great time.
And then I have one in Orlando for late October for the Learning Leaders conference. So if you happen to be in learning and development, ironically, I will be speaking with my sister. She is my co presenter.
She does some work with me as well.
I've made it a family thing. But we will be talking again about accessibility, but why it is the best kept secret in corporate and how some people are dismissing it.
[00:18:48] Speaker A: What are your thoughts from an AI perspective on accessibility?
[00:18:56] Speaker B: I don't hate it.
I believe it or Not. I actually get this question a lot because I do graphics too, and, you know, I do art. And so some people kind of ask, like, how do I feel about it? I feel like AI has a lot of potential when it comes to a plethora of things. I do feel like it is lagging when it comes to accessibility and it comes to this space.
And part of that is because there is a gap there.
AI can pull from information from certain years and things.
Accessibility standards, actual real standards and guidelines are constantly changing. And so there is a gap in between what it can give you in that vein versus what is in existence today. But I will say it is still good for just an overview of things, asking it, how are people, you know, a little different, getting some more information, being more informed, more knowledgeable? So I think it has an amazing potential, you know, to give us what we need. If you're asking it to create a full program with accessibility and all the things, it will fail.
It will fail for a lot of reasons. I've actually try to, like, generate images that are accessible from it just to kind of see. And they tend to be very generic, very, very simplistic.
Not something that's visually appealing and that will catch people very well. But that's just where it is, right? So you do have to have some knowledge of it. But it can be a really good assistant if you want to learn more. If you want to learn just some basic things about how to structure a meeting for somebody who has adhd, how to structure a meeting for somebody who has autism. What does it mean to be colorblind? What does it mean to be dyslexic? It is a really good tool for people to become more knowledgeable. And I think that that's an important part of the journey, like the advocacy, the action, all of those things can look different. And sometimes it can just be to open some more knowledge and be more aware.
[00:21:04] Speaker A: I thought about as you were sharing your feedback on graphic design. I'm a marketer. I've been doing marketing for 15 years.
And man, when I see people do stuff like putting yellow on red, oh, my glasses off, I can't even see it.
So things like that, you know, on one hand, people have become empowered to create their own. Create their own content using tools that are more easily accessible than Photoshop.
But graphic designers who have studied the these sciences and know the difference makes a world of difference again in just how graphics are visible. So especially in a digital forum, please add some spacing between these lines.
Padding is your friend. White space is. It's okay. It's really okay.
There's too many fonts.
Please, you know, all of those things for visibility perspectives. There's a newsletter that I get from my school and bless the schools because they just need help. But there's too many fonts. This is a scripted font. Oh man, it stressed me out. So things of, of that nature, even though. And I wear glasses too. So I, I was, I was offended because I had to go get my glasses to read my phone.
And so all of these ways centers the need again to consider others. I think that's at the bottom of all of this.
Why, why would we sacrifice productivity? Sacrifice inclusion for productivity is where we are, you know, people. Oh, I'll just use Chat GPT to design it. And it doesn't have the intricacies, as you mentioned, around real accessibility. Still asking videographers or SRT files, send me an SRT file. You don't know what that is. I'm going to let this email sit for about 30 minutes until you, you Google it. Because I have to have the SRT files because this video is for a corporate client and we don't know who's watching it and they may need that.
[00:23:27] Speaker B: People don't know what an SRT file is. I'm like, okay, so we need to talk.
And it's. And it's not even something that takes a long time. Like there are websites now. Just click it, generate it.
I always tell people, if you're going to use AI captions, make sure those are actually correct because sometimes they are not.
But even going to some of these websites, you can pay five bucks, six bucks and get human captions that are correct burned in. They look great.
You can get the SRT file version of it. There's so many different ways that people can address these things. And some of it AI helps with like. It doesn't take me as long now to do like captions and transcripts, they're great.
But you've got to at least know the fundamentals. And that's why I'm like awareness, knowledge is the key.
And just like you said, coming down to somewhat still the people thing, we are all people at one point or another in our lives.
We will all need bigger fonts.
We will all need some changes in the way things look because we age, we don't stay our one wonderful, you know, younger twenties forever with perfect vision and all of the things.
So you do need to think about it even in that lens, even if you're not thinking for neurodivergent people.
People are people. There are different ages. You might have a temporary disability at some point, like with an eye patch. You just never know.
So it's important to really, really kind of dial into that.
[00:25:08] Speaker A: That's so true. I really enjoyed our conversation and hope that our listeners, wherever they fall in their learning journey, is to one, respect others, save space for learning new things about the various ways that everyone thinks, and to be an advocate when they feel as if justice is required. Rebecca, is there anything else you want to leave our listeners with today?
[00:25:35] Speaker B: Nothing other than just remember, humans are humans.
Everybody matters. Everybody deserves an opportunity to succeed and to be their best selves. So however you can contribute to that and make the world better, do that.
[00:25:54] Speaker A: I love that. And where can we find you?
[00:25:56] Speaker B: Online, mostly on LinkedIn. I'm there all the time, so feel free to search me.
Email rebecca.prajonbgc.net and you can also go to my website, www.ebgc.net.
[00:26:12] Speaker A: Awesome. Well, thank you so much. This has been another episode of Unscripted with Zanetta Chinika Power. And we'll see you next time.
[00:26:19] Speaker B: Bye.
